jon is now in the presence of God, having tragically passed a few years ago.
Re: [faithmaps] Modernity and the Events of 11 Sept
The following is an edited message that I sent to some dear people but I thought I would share this on fm. Feel free to respond, criticize, or whatever. However, the issues here are for me settled by Scripture and I will not budge off their authority.
I have several things to share with you! I think I will, first of all, share with you what I think the real Christian response to the events of 9/11/01 ought to be. I will then share with you some Scripture and some thoughts from those Scriptures that I hope might help to focus on the complexity of the events and the complexity of our own beings which are torn with conflicting thoughts, emotions, and impulses over these events.
(1) I think the proper Christian response to what happened on 9/11/01 would be prayer, of course, but then action. It seems to me the proper actions from Christians is to seek out the terrorists and the terrorists states and to reach out to them in the Love of Christ, with the Gospel of Christ, and with the full knowledge that probably they, the Christians, will be killed. This should be done with the commitment that there will be wave upon wave of Christians going to these people with the true agape love of Christ willing to be killed to extend the love of Christ to these people. I think that eventually if there were wave upon wave of Christians willing to give up their lives for God’s truth, the terrorists would first of all see that they have no monopoly on martyrs and they would see that the Christian motives are the radical love and life of Jesus Christ!!!!!!!!!!!!
Clearly this would be the Christian thing to do, would it not? On a small scale, missionary Jim Eliot was killed and eaten by the Auca Indians. A year or so later, his wife Elisabeth Elliot and others went to the Aucas in the love of Christ and the Aucas received Christ as Lord and changed their ways!
Surely God is able! I also believe that He may in fact be telling His Church that this is what HE wants from them! We were not saved to be comfortable, we were saved to serve Him, love Him, and obey Him. Our lives are not our own. But who among us is radical enough to volunteer to go the terrorists and to the terrorist countries and also overcome the logistical problems of finding them? Is it not time for radical Christianity to occur? [I do not think there can be Christianity at all, if it is not radical!] Everyone has been “sobered" by what happened and more and more people who have been ignoring God want to pray and have prayer meetings. Great! But prayer, if it is God honoring should lead to actions and changes in the way we live, should it not?
(2) Now I continue with Scripture and thoughts based on Scripture:
Show me a Christian that is not experiencing some internal conflict about how to properly react to what has happened. We all are still internally divided between the tensions of the flesh and the Spirit, between our old man and the New Man in Christ Jesus. So, all of us are undoubtedly having some conflict within ourselves about how to react and how to respond to people with whom we are having discussions about 9/11 and its effects and its consequences which include how does each of us as an individual and as a member of our nation respond.
The first thing I think that needs to be considered is the “double intentionality” of human events. I think of Joseph’s explanations to his brothers as to their conduct. Genesis 45:5-7 NASB
5 “Now do not be grieved or angry with yourselves, because you sold me here, for God sent me before you to preserve life.
6 “For the famine has been in the land these two years, and there are still five years in which there will be neither plowing nor harvesting.
7 “God sent me before you to preserve for you a remnant in the earth, and to keep you alive by a great deliverance.
8 “Now, therefore, it was not you who sent me here, but God; and He has made me a father to Pharaoh and Lord of all his household and ruler over all the land of Egypt.
Genesis 50:18-21 NASB
18 Then his brothers also came and fell down before him and said, “Behold, we are your servants.”
19 But Joseph said to them, “Do not be afraid, for am I in God’s place?
20 “As for you, you meant evil against me, but God meant it for good in order to bring about this present result, to preserve many people alive.
21 “So therefore, do not be afraid; I will provide for you and your little ones.” So he comforted them and spoke kindly to them.
There is a double intentionality here explicitly articulated. The vertical intentionality of the Sovereign God and the horizontal intentionality of humans and God uses the horizontal intentionality of humans for His purpose. Note Joseph’s statement “Now, therefore, it was not you who sent me here, but God.” God’s intentionality is sovereign over human intentionality.
God uses the wicked and evil acts of people for His Good purposes
Gen. 50:20 “As for you, you meant evil against me, but God meant it for good in order to bring about this present result, to preserve many people alive. See Romans 8:28!
The most radical event that illustrates this is recorded in these verses which I quote:
Acts 2:22-24 NASB
22 “Men of Israel, listen to these words: Jesus the Nazarene, a man attested to you by God with miracles and wonders and signs which God performed through Him in your midst, just as you yourselves know—
23 this Man, delivered over by the predetermined plan and foreknowledge of God, you nailed to a cross by the hands of godless men and put Him to death.
24 “But God raised Him up again, putting an end to the agony of death, since it was impossible for Him to be held in its power.
Acts 4:24-28 NASB
24 And when they heard this, they lifted their voices to God with one accord and said, “O Lord, it is You who made the heaven and the earth and the sea, and all that is in them,
25 who by the Holy Spirit, through the mouth of our father David Your servant, said,
‘Why did the Gentiles rage,
And the peoples devise futile things?
26 ‘The kings of the earth took their stand,
And the rulers were gathered together
Against the Lord and against His Christ.’
27 “For truly in this city there were gathered together against Your holy servant Jesus, whom You anointed, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, along with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel,
28 to do whatever Your hand and Your purpose predestined to occur.
Here we see the double intentionality. So, certainly what was done to us was evil! But that does not blaspheme God! Look at Isaiah 45:7 and Amos 3:6
Here I must quote from the American Standard Version of 1901 which unlike the NASB does not fudge from a literal translation of the text:
5 I am Jehovah, and there is none else; besides me there is no God. I will gird thee, though thou hast not known me; 6 that they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none besides me: I am Jehovah, and there is none else. 7 I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil. I am Jehovah, that doeth all these things. 8 Distil, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, that it may bring forth salvation, and let it cause righteousness to spring up together; I, Jehovah, have created it. 9 Woe unto him that striveth with his Maker! a potsherd among the potsherds of the earth! Shall the clay say to him that fashioneth it, What makest thou? or thy work, He hath no hands? 10 Woe unto him that saith unto a father, What begettest thou? or to a woman, With what travailest thou?
The Hebrew text has ‘evil’ not ‘calamity’ as the NASB translates it. And it ought to be clear that this evil is righteous judicial punishment from God and not anything that makes God, Himself, evil!
Amos 3:1-6 ASV 1901
3 Hear this word that Jehovah hath spoken against you, O children of Israel, against the whole family which I brought up out of the land of Egypt, saying, 2 You only have I known of all the families of the earth: therefore I will visit upon you all your iniquities. 3 Shall two walk together, except they have agreed? 4 Will a lion roar in the forest, when he hath no prey? will a young lion cry out of his den, if he have taken nothing? 5 Can a bird fall in a snare upon the earth, where no gin is set for him? shall a snare spring up from the ground, and have taken nothing at all? 6 Shall the trumpet be blown in a city, and the people not be afraid? shall evil befall a city, and Jehovah hath not done it? 7 Surely the Lord Jehovah will do nothing, except he reveal his secret unto his servants the prophets. 8 The lion hath roared; who will not fear? The Lord Jehovah hath spoken; who can but prophesy?
Please read verse 6 in context!!!!! This evil is God’s righteous judicial punishment! God is not evil, thereby!
These verses underscore the precious promise of Romans 8:28 ASV 1901:
28 And we know that to them that love God all things work together for good, even to them that are called according to his purpose.
29 For whom he foreknew, he also foreordained to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren: 30 and whom he foreordained, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who is against us? 32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not also with him freely give us all things? 33 Who shall lay anything to the charge of God’s elect? It is God that justifieth;
So please see the double intentionality that is there in all human events!!!
Was what happened in NYC and Washington and in the Pittsburgh area an evil act on the terrorists part! Of course. Did God decree this evil act? Of course, He did. To say He allowed it is just wimpy compromising mush that is incoherent, if the Scriptures are taken as God’s Word. (Read Isaiah 45:7 and Amos 3:6 again!) He ordained or decreed this event as He does all evil events such as the acts of Joseph’s brothers and such as the crucifixion. He ordained that Judas turn Jesus in. Jesus called Judas the “Son of Perdition and said “it would have been better if Judas had never been born.” Did God love Judas? Did God decree to have Judas born and to use him in this way? Romans 9 gives a good summary of what God has always been doing with humans. [ If you think that I am misinterpreting Romans 9, then you apply your interpretation to Paul's questions at verse 14 and verse 19 and see if your interpretation can handle his questions!] None of this is pleasant to talk about for our sensibilities are conflicted and yet if we bow to His Word written, I think, we will be better off!
Also, this country has no covenant relationship with God! We are not Israel. There is no doubt that He has from the beginning of our history blessed this country!!!!!!!!!!! There is no doubt that He could have judged us more severely than He has and earlier. I think the reason that He has not goes back to the fact there is a large minority of people in this country who belong to Him!!!!! Yet, there is no doubt that what happened on 9/11/01 was a wake up call and at the deepest level a call to the USA as a nation to repent of our numerous sins and change our ways. None of which was said in that ghastly “national cathedral service.”
Tuesday, I thought, in my grief, of 30,000 000 plus babies destroyed in their mother’s wombs. And for what reason? They were inconvenient to their “mothers.” I think of politicians who support “partial birth abortions” which are acts of infanticide! I think of all the crime in high places that goes unpunished including Clinton’s numerous acts. I think of our indiscriminate bombing of Iraq and our sanctions that have killed thousands of innocents in Iraq when we did not have the foresight to get rid of Saddam, and all the deaths that have occurred in Iraq since 1991 due at least partly to our stupid policies. I think of Christendom in the USA that is so pagan and idolatrous and scarcely a person sees that!
God is not mocked! He has plenty of his real people here and what we as a nation need is a full scale revival [Revival is a work of the Sovereign God! It is not something that christendom announces it will have next week!] so that more and more people will be born again and begin to see all people through the eyes of Christ!!!! If that happens, that will be wonderful. Here also is the double intentionality at work. Only God can bring true revival and I do not believe that He will ever do that without at least one person dedicating his or her life to unceasing prayers of repentance for the nation and for revival. I think of the 1858 revival that begin in lower Manhattan in the financial area with one brother, broken hearted praying for revival and the Lord was pleased to answer his prayer. The revival eventually was world wide in its scope. There is a Banner of Truth small book that describes that revival. The authors name, I think was Samuel Prime. He was a witness to it.
This Sunday as I met with our fellowship, I shared how conflicted I was. I said there are three ways to react to what happened as 1 a citizen, 2 as a human and 3 as a Christian. I found conflicting reactions in me and so assumed others were having a similar experience.
As I have indicated from the point of Scripture this event is complex. God decreed it. It is an evil act that the terrorists did, but God means it for good FOR those whom He loves, who have been called according to His purpose!
28And we know that to them that love God all things work together for good, even to them that are called according to his purpose.
29For whom he foreknew, he also foreordained to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren: 30and whom he foreordained, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
31What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who is against us? 32He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not also with him freely give us all things? 33Who shall lay anything to the charge of God’s elect? It is God that justifieth;
